Grow Like Topsy

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B:
13:29:36
chinese don't like france anymore do they
Wenjie:
13:29:45
not really..
Wenjie:
13:29:59
actually everybody in China is talking about this..
B:
13:30:06
yes i told you
Wenjie:
13:30:09
and
Wenjie:
13:30:21
people say they wont use French Brand anymore
B:
13:30:26
yep
B:
13:30:29
i know
Wenjie:
13:30:33
you the picture
B:
13:30:38
?
Wenjie:
13:30:39
its in Shanghai
Wenjie:
13:31:06
its just the next building to our resturant in the big mall on Nanjingroad
Wenjie:
13:31:39
the guy is suggesting people stop buying LuisVitton
B:
13:32:13
well, the problem is that is not that simple
B:
13:32:28
people think french were against china
B:
13:32:38
but what about UK and the US ?
B:
13:32:59
the same kind of events happened there as well
Wenjie:
13:33:23
hmm
Wenjie:
13:33:34
actually all of them are supposed to against China
B:
13:33:45
it's not just France who's againts the chinese governmant
Wenjie:
13:33:54
actually have been doing this for 500 years
B:
13:34:01
what ?
Wenjie:
13:34:17
these countries
Wenjie:
13:34:27
against china
B:
13:34:35
.... no link
Wenjie:
13:34:43
I mean
B:
13:34:48
this has nothing to do with being against china
B:
13:35:09
they were just protesting against the chinese behaviour in tibet
B:
13:35:24
and the fact that you have no freedom of speech in china
Wenjie:
13:35:34
these countries have been against China for many years since the end of Qing Dynasty they came into China. Things are far complicated than this
B:
13:35:36
so i don't see how this is bad against chinese
B:
13:35:44
only against the chinese government
Wenjie:
13:36:00
of course its bad
Wenjie:
13:36:05
why they do this?
B:
13:36:05
how ?
Wenjie:
13:36:27
is not because there is no democratic in China
Wenjie:
13:36:36
all is about money and power
B:
13:36:36
the thing is that chinese don't know what they are talking about
B:
13:36:47
no it's not right
Wenjie:
13:37:02
why
B:
13:37:07
because people who protested against the olympics in china have no interest
Wenjie:
13:37:22
you know why it happens
Wenjie:
13:37:27
tibet is just a tool
Wenjie:
13:37:33
an excuse
B:
13:38:04
for  NGOs to protest against the absense of freedom in china
Wenjie:
13:38:19
what kind of freedom
B:
13:38:23
do you know how many people have been executed last year in china ?
Wenjie:
13:38:28
and how they are absent in China?
Wenjie:
13:38:46
executed for what
B:
13:38:54
and do you know that chinese that have criticised the olympics have been put into jail ?
Wenjie:
13:39:09
what is your point
B:
13:39:11
official number : 500 ( but they suspect much more )
Wenjie:
13:39:35
what is this?
Wenjie:
13:39:41
I dont know what are you talking about
B:
13:39:54
"and do you know that chinese that have criticised the olympics have been put into jail ?" this doesn't ring teh bell ? you don't even have the right to tell what you are really thinkning
B:
13:40:09
or you might end up in prison
Wenjie:
13:40:13
are you sure its true?
B:
13:40:16
yes
Wenjie:
13:40:24
do you know the whole story?
B:
13:40:44
well i guess you can look up the web for it
B:
13:40:52
( avoid chinese web sites though )
Wenjie:
13:40:54
why those Chinese critisised their own countries event?
B:
13:41:01
.....
Wenjie:
13:41:01
why
Wenjie:
13:41:08
Imean
Wenjie:
13:41:11
all these
B:
13:41:19
i mean i also critise politics in my country
Wenjie:
13:41:19
these comments
B:
13:41:25
and also some events
Wenjie:
13:41:25
by the WESTerns
Wenjie:
13:41:32
or by Chinese government
Wenjie:
13:41:49
how can you be sure which side is telling the truth
Wenjie:
13:42:25
if CNN , BBC and other big media is still telling the truth
Wenjie:
13:42:40
are you sure you dont have mindset concerning this topic?
B:
13:42:49
well i don't really trust CNN
Wenjie:
13:43:10
thats the point
B:
13:43:26
you have to read different newspapers to get your own opinion and from different countries
Wenjie:
13:43:30
if these so called big media in the world are not telling the truth
Wenjie:
13:43:33
it is really terrible
B:
13:43:53
"well i don't really trust CNN" when they are talking about us elections
Wenjie:
13:44:02
cuz they really have great impact on people's thinking all over the world
Wenjie:
13:44:16
they should take responsibility to this
B:
13:44:29
....
Wenjie:
13:44:29
its not a school broadcaster
B:
13:44:37
then what about chinese newspapers
B:
13:44:45
you can't believe anything in them
Wenjie:
13:44:46
I dont know this
Wenjie:
13:44:56
because I never read chinese newspaper
Wenjie:
13:45:11
and all I know it
Wenjie:
13:45:13
is
Wenjie:
13:45:20
it's all about money
Wenjie:
13:45:44
from my economic major
Wenjie:
13:47:02
cuz its really a big treat to many western countries that China as well as other emerging markets are taking over the world economy , if not now, but its their fear and theri imagination
Wenjie:
13:47:17
and of coure
Wenjie:
13:47:57
if they can , they will do anything to protect their world top postion
Wenjie:
13:48:12
its understandable
Wenjie:
13:48:20
but concerning the olympic
B:
13:48:24
well no one is happy with this protestation around the world (from the money point of view i mean)
Wenjie:
13:48:37
the act
Wenjie:
13:48:40
of FRance
Wenjie:
13:48:43
UK
Wenjie:
13:48:50
 and many other countries
B:
13:48:50
"if they can , they will do anything to protect their world top postion" .... you can't do anything
Wenjie:
13:48:58
is really weird
Wenjie:
13:49:01
because
Wenjie:
13:49:08
Olympic
Wenjie:
13:49:14
is a presentation of
Wenjie:
13:49:18
PEACE
B:
13:49:22
it's not the government it's the people, teh ones that don't care about money but freedom
Wenjie:
13:49:45
there is no reason for them to stop the torch , (if we dont talk about other things)
Wenjie:
13:50:05
you cant use Tibet as an excuse
Wenjie:
13:50:11
and its a lousy excuse
Wenjie:
13:50:32
people
Wenjie:
13:50:47
its not people
B:
13:50:51
it is
Wenjie:
13:51:02
it is the superface
B:
13:51:04
no one asked them to do that
Wenjie:
13:51:06
if the media
Wenjie:
13:51:46
and the government dont support this, or ,spread the bad side of China
Wenjie:
13:51:49
and Tibet
Wenjie:
13:52:14
(we dont talk about the thing they spread is true or not, if its based on personal judgement or not)
Wenjie:
13:52:30
people will not do this
Wenjie:
13:52:40
you should know who control everything
Wenjie:
13:52:48
and also
Wenjie:
13:52:54
people is tool too
Wenjie:
13:53:46
anyway
Wenjie:
13:53:52
there are a lot to be discussed
Wenjie:
13:53:56
and argued
Wenjie:
13:53:59
but
Wenjie:
13:54:35
I saw on youbube
Wenjie:
13:54:44
a lot of Tibet people
Wenjie:
13:54:47
in Parise
Wenjie:
13:55:00
they are trying to stop the fire
Wenjie:
13:55:07
and its really really a bad thing
Wenjie:
13:55:10
in my opinion
Wenjie:
13:56:27
cuz Olympic torch means a lot , and there are a lot of ways to show your anger to China but not this way..
B:
13:57:05
well i agree o that
B:
13:57:14
people are stupid on both sides
B:
13:57:34
but the torch was definetly not a good idea
Wenjie:
13:57:57
You know in acient Greece
B:
13:57:59
and it will probably be suppressed next time
Wenjie:
13:58:09
even peole are in fierce war situation
B:
13:58:22
( by the way it's a french man who created the modern olympics )
Wenjie:
13:58:23
if there is Olympic
Wenjie:
13:58:34
both sides will stop
Wenjie:
13:58:39
and now
B:
13:58:43
says the legend
Wenjie:
13:58:57
this great intuity rule has been broken
B:
13:59:09
but at that time i guess it was linked with gods
B:
13:59:17
it's not the first time
Wenjie:
13:59:33
I dont know what will happen if the terminal presentation of Peace, olympic, has been a tool to show anger
B:
13:59:33
olympics always had a politic purpose
B:
13:59:53
even Hitler used it
B:
14:00:15
what else can you excpect
B:
14:00:44
i mean it's an event that the whole world will watch, if you want to touch everyone, it's the perfect occasion
Wenjie:
14:00:58
yes
Wenjie:
14:01:03
that's why I say it's terrible
B:
14:01:06
and china also used it in a political way....
Wenjie:
14:01:17
there is nothing could be safe nowdays
B:
14:01:19
to show how they're growing
B:
14:01:28
and to increase their tourism
Wenjie:
14:01:30
911
Wenjie:
14:01:37
is another good example
B:
14:01:37
i mean there's no secret there
Wenjie:
14:01:48
what I mean
Wenjie:
14:01:49
is
Wenjie:
14:02:01
people dont care about ANYTHING anymore
Wenjie:
14:03:59
I can feel the world is full of danger
Wenjie:
14:04:04
I mean
Wenjie:
14:04:15
you think its a peacefull world
Wenjie:
14:04:24
but actually wars happen everyday
Wenjie:
14:05:13
if there is interest conflict
Wenjie:
14:05:16
and
Wenjie:
14:05:45
China is really in a hard situation
Wenjie:
14:06:01
its just like a young animal growing fast
Wenjie:
14:06:20
around it is many powerful and huge ones
Wenjie:
14:06:31
they dont really give it chance to grow
Wenjie:
14:06:39
because of fearness
Wenjie:
14:08:24
in my opinion China is far from taking over the position of the western economy
Wenjie:
14:08:50
there exists huge huge problem in the whole system of the society
Wenjie:
14:09:01
and Chinese government is really a tough one
Wenjie:
14:09:31
the speed of growth of China is kinda significant
Wenjie:
14:09:50
10% growth every year
Wenjie:
14:09:54
compare to
Wenjie:
14:09:57
for example
B:
14:10:00
100% percent you mean
Wenjie:
14:10:04
2% in Danmark
Wenjie:
14:10:07
no
Wenjie:
14:10:10
I mean GDP
Wenjie:
14:10:45
everybody believes China as well as Indea
Wenjie:
14:10:55
are gonna takeover the world
B:
14:11:00
yes
Wenjie:
14:11:03
this probally the reason
B:
14:11:04
and they probably will
B:
14:11:14
economicaly at least
Wenjie:
14:11:33
what should I say about this
B:
14:11:34
but i still think the social system will be better in europe
Wenjie:
14:11:42
of course
Wenjie:
14:11:58
economic growth is just one aspect
B:
14:11:59
but france is going really bad these days
B:
14:12:17
economy + social
B:
14:12:30
they will suffer from their right government
Wenjie:
14:13:06
its not hard to understand France's situation
Wenjie:
14:13:20
both France
Wenjie:
14:13:22
Germany
Wenjie:
14:13:24
UK
Wenjie:
14:13:37
are the countries against China most
Wenjie:
14:13:39
in Europe
B:
14:14:00
this has nothing to do with taht.....
Wenjie:
14:14:06
and actually their economy situation are the most connected with China
Wenjie:
14:14:23
they can really feel the pain
B:
14:14:24
so they have no interest in being against china
B:
14:14:44
they should get as close to china as possible
Wenjie:
14:15:07
yes
Wenjie:
14:15:11
but not the way you think
B:
14:15:20
??
B:
14:15:25
anyway i have to work
Wenjie:
14:16:07
what they think is to put every low skilled labor force work in China and absorb all the talented
B:
14:16:27
well yes
B:
14:16:35
this is how china is growing....
Wenjie:
14:16:55
they thing is now China is not only able to do simple work
B:
14:17:04
yep
Wenjie:
14:17:07
and that's why they start to fear
B:
14:17:29
i don't think they fear
Wenjie:
14:17:56
then what
B:
14:18:08
when china will become to expensive they will turn to another cheap country
B:
14:18:17
;)
Wenjie:
14:18:20
...
Wenjie:
14:18:22
faint
B:
14:18:47
but anyway i don't think the delocalization will continue very long
Wenjie:
14:18:58
ok
B:
14:19:11
the enviroment will probbaly change the rules
B:
14:19:35
we'll go back to landmade products
B:
14:19:41
( hopefully )
Wenjie:
14:19:44
but what about Chinese take over the highly skilled job and wage becomes higher or as high as in Europe??
Wenjie:
14:22:40
。。。。。。。 结果是我们还是什么的都没讨论出来。我也不知道我们在这里讨论有什么意义。我个人的力量是多么的微小。 但是我知道我们国家有一个韬光养晦的政策，在很久以前。我很佩服想出这个政策的人，也为我们国家这么多年来基于这个政策一直所做的努力而感动。中国发展举世共睹。但这是不够的。看，那么多人想要刺激我们，想让我们愤怒而做出一些错误的决定。 大家真的要冷静。 发展经济是唯一能够让我们国家强大的。 我们正在走上一条绝路。没有其他的alternative。 大家想一想在读书的时候，班机里的落后生，那些默默地赶上来的同学。那些把一切精力都用在学习上从此不顾别人眼光的人。 中国就是这样的一个国家。 我觉得中国人民是一个坚毅的民族，包括我们国家的领导人们。 我也相信他们所做的一切都是为了这个国家。 虽然有很多问题，但是一个国家在发展，怎么可能没有问题？ 我不知道自己是不是爱国，有时后我甚至觉得自己非常无视我们国家。也不能明显体会到自己和这个国家有多么近的距离。但是我希望我们国家强大，希望不再听到那些欧洲人讨论中国的不是。虽然有时候他们看似是客观的，也辩解着说自己对中国没有偏见，也不想讨论政治。但是那时我总是有冲动想要和他们辩论，虽然知道自己其实对我们这个国家知道的很少。（这其中有主观也有客观的原因），没有足够的力量。我不知道自己是否已经成了一个中国的愚民，在这片陌生的欧洲大陆上。 奇怪的是，我们觉得自己不爱国，但当别人说自己国家不是的时候，却心里觉得难受。 每个人都是这样。 当全世界都想讨伐中国的时候。我们该怎么办？我们到底哪里错了？还是我们其实没有错？ 至少我没有答案。我知道中国肯定有不对的地方。也知道很多问题是小错铸成大错。然后深深地埋在了那里。西方国家抓到把柄就会大肆宣扬。他们的用意我们很多人也不是不清楚。这个世界其实很小，你死我活。这个是原因。中国会不会take over这个世界（经济上的）我不知道，但是我们每个人都应该知道当你出乎意料地飞速成长的时候会有一些人想把你扼杀的。这个也是自然界生存的定律。因为资源是有限的，地位是有限的。 我只能说到这里。其实我还是一个对一切都一无所知的人。我只是心里难过。我们不要抵制这抵制那的了。要抵制也不是一天两天的事，靠 5月1 日 单单对家了副的抵制，什么意义都没有。只不过是争一时的面子。自己做好分内的事情才是关键。还是想说，经济发展是一切的根本。